Since founding Crowns and Hops in 2016, Beny Ashburn and Teo Hunter have been on a mission to create a Black space in an industry with very few Black owners; for context, according to a report from the National Black Brewer’s Association, in 2024 only 86 of the 9,761 craft breweries in the U.S. were Black-owned, less than 1% overall. And until this past May, one milestone had eluded Ashburn and Hunter: a physical location of their own where they could sell their beer on tap.

Now, Ashburn and Hunter have a chance to do just that with a pop-up taproom residency in partnership with Creature Comforts DTLA, available through the end of September. “Marketplace” host Kai Ryssdal spoke with the co-founders at the taproom about the space, as well as what it’s been like operate during the protests and where they’d like to take their brand next. The following is transcript of their conversation.

Kai Ryssdal: How's business?

Teo Hunter: It's tough. It is tough. We are located in the Fashion District of Downtown LA, and I think it's safe to say that perception about this region in general is tough, and people don't understand that there's still entrepreneurs like us that are creating space for the community to be patronized.

Ryssdal: We got to talk about, since you mentioned where we are, we’ve got to talk about the timing of this interview. We were going to come talk to you all two-and-a-half weeks ago, when the protests were happening, ICE was happening, the National Guard was [first] deployed to Los Angeles. They're all still here. The city is fine, and everybody needs to know that. But I guess I wonder how that affected what it is that you all do, because we decided maybe it wasn't a great time to come and chat.

Beny Ashburn: Yeah, we agreed. Being specifically in the area where a lot of that is taking place, I think it's difficult. You have to really balance the understanding of supporting the important initiatives in what's going on in the cultural and economic environment, but then you also have to run a business, but you wanted people to be safe. You don't want people to necessarily come outside to celebrate, because this wasn't a celebratory moment. We knew we had to gut check with our team and our staff to make sure everyone did feel safe, and that this environment would be a place where people can come and gather.

Ryssdal: Talk to me about the gut check. Keep going. What'd they say, the folks who work for you?

Ashburn: I think what's special about this particular place in downtown LA, it is like a little oasis. So when I say gut check, we had to ask ourselves, is it safe to be down here? And yeah, we thought it was a good place to stay.

Hunter: And even more than safety, our neighbors are impacted, period. We are a Black-owned business and we are in a brown state. And we have seen our neighbors disappear. We have seen our neighbors not show up for their businesses that ultimately support their families, that support their neighborhoods, and you know, to Beny's point, we didn't want to sound tone deaf by just saying you know nothing's happening. But what we continue to do was be open any time we could, to project that we were here. We are here for the people that occupy, live and work in this community. And our community was impacted period, so it was heavy for us to, again, be entrepreneurs, project our business, but also make sure that we didn't sound like we were tone deaf to those that have been impacted.

Ryssdal: When we first spoke out in Inglewood, you were, thought, like this close to getting your own taproom, and that fell through for a whole lot of reasons. How big is it now for you to have this opportunity to do this pop-up here?

Hunter: It's huge. I think what you are seeing is the community within the community, the beer industry, partnering in order to not just survive, but to thrive together. And in my opinion, what that does is it instills a consumer confidence that a lot of people are wondering if it's even still there.

Ryssdal: I need to understand, though, why- we, the three of us, made such a big deal out of Inglewood that first time we spoke. And if you all, a Black-owned business in a vastly majority white industry, right, couldn't get yourself set up in a place in Inglewood, what happened? Why not?

Ashburn: Like you said, I think there were a lot of reasons, particularly post-COVID, why that property didn't necessarily work. But I think what's so beautiful about the Crowns and Hops brand is honestly we could take space anywhere, and the community still exists, and it still follows, because we're bigger than just our location. We are a brand that is built for the community.

Ryssdal: You all have talked about being a case study for- DEI is a loaded phrase, but for that concept in this industry. How's it going?

Hunter: I think what you see in this partnership, the residency, is exactly what we've always talked about. Racial equity is a tide that lifts all ships. There is now the compounding of revenue in this particular building that is happening because our two brands, an established brand based out of Athens Georgia that may not have had as much velocity coming to this particular location, and a Black-owned brewery based out of Inglewood that now has a place to point its community to, that is now bolstering the overall revenue for this space. That is a win-win, in our opinion.

Ryssdal: It's been nine years now, right? 2016-ish?

Ashburn: Wow. Look at you knowing facts.

Ryssdal: Come on. Can't walk in empty minded, you know?

Ashburn: It has it, yeah, wow.

Hunter: Going on a decade.

Ryssdal: Are you tired?

Ashburn: Honestly, yes. But when you are so passionate and you love something so much, being tired isn't enough to stop. And every day that we do this, especially now, having a physical space where people are physically coming here and saying to us, I have been waiting for years for you, too, to open up your own taproom that I can now come in, that I can bring my friends, and it's in those moments where you sit here and you just look around and you see all these people that have been supporting you for so many years, it makes you care even more. And I think this pivoting for the brand, this reinvention of having this space, is kind of like that jolt of passion and energy into really understanding why we started this in 2016.

Ryssdal: Let's say this is an amazing success, this pop-up. Then what?

Hunter: I think again, we have always been focused on creating space like this in neighborhoods that have never experienced it. That's still our goal. We have made a commitment not to get over our skis on anything right now, in being responsible, not only to ourselves, our families and our investors, but that is still the goal. We had a Father's Day event to where we invited fathers, young and old, to bring their families and to take a professional portrait, and Beny and I stood in this courtyard in straight tears because we were just blown away to see the connection, to see all those narratives that are thrown out there about us that are so destructive and toxic just fall away. Not in this space. And that's the space that we're always focused on creating.