What lobbying Congress can really buy

Make Me Smart March 1, 2023 Transcript

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Reema Khrais 

Yeah, so all good on my end.

Kimberly Adams 

Excellent. We’re good to go.

Reema Khrais 

Alright, let’s do it.

Kimberly Adams 

We are doing it! Welcome back to make me smart where we make today make sense. Kai is out today, but joining me is Reema Khrais, the host of the Marketplace podcast “This is Uncomfortable.” Welcome Reema.

Reema Khrais 

Oh, hello, thanks for having me. I’m happy to be here. Especially on what do you want to know Wednesday?

Kimberly Adams 

Because we want to know so many things. And apparently you all did, too.

Reema Khrais 

All the things.

Kimberly Adams 

Yes, all of the things. This is the day in the week where we get to hear and answer your questions. And you can get your question onto the podcast, by leaving us a voicemail at 508-U-B-SMART, or you can email us at makemesmart@marketplace.org.

Reema Khrais 

All right. And with that, let’s get to our first question. It comes from Ryan in Colorado, and it is about the recent train derailment disaster in Ohio. He says he was reading about how much money the train company Norfolk Southern has spent on lobbying. And he wants to know, “what do companies or special interest groups spend on money when they lobby Congress members?” You want to take that Kimberly?

Kimberly Adams 

Yeah, because I’m here in DC, which is lobbying capital of the country. I live next door to a lovely lobbyist actually. Lobbying is basically an attempt by any group or individual to influence government decisions. And this can be done by trying to convince elected officials to support or reject certain policies, or sometimes just to stay out of it and let things play out. Open Secrets tracks this quite a bit. And they found that $4.09 billion were spent on federal lobbying in 2022. We’re not even getting into the amount spent on lobbying state legislatures and things like that, which is a whole other can of worms. But lobbying can be done by anybody in the US. So I had a friend who used to work for a car company. And even though he was like an engineer and a test driver, they would send him up to the Hill to help them with their lobbying efforts. So that, you know, they could see that they were real blue collar workers, and everything like that. But yeah, so money for lobbying can be spent like that: flying people who represent a particular issue to Washington to lobby members of Congress. Making flyers, running advertising campaigns, hosting events on the Hill or in member’s home districts, or whatever. And anybody can do this. This could be, you know, environmental groups, it can be labor unions, it can be private companies. But there are some groups that spend more than others. So for instance, for every dollar that labor unions and public interest groups spend on lobbying, private companies spend $34. And again, they’re paying professional lobbyists to talk to and influence lawmakers. Sometimes those people research bills and draft bills. Sometimes they fund trade groups that actually do the lobbying for them, those private companies, and that’s where we get to the Norfolk Southern example that he was asking about. So Norfolk Southern is a member of the American Association of Railroads, which is an industry group. And that group spent close to $40 million lobbying the federal government, including media campaigns, maybe like meals with lawmakers, travel, all those normal things. Not an exhaustive list, but those are the types of things a lobbying money gets spent on. And as for Norfolk, Southern, it spent on its own, $1.8 million last year on lobbying according to Open Secrets. And apparently, just a few months before the derailment, Norfolk Southern president met with transportation secretary Pete Buttigieg to raise concerns about a federal rule that would require two crew members to operate trains instead of one with the idea that that might help prevent, you know, derailments, crashes, etc.

Reema Khrais 

So interesting. I was curious about this myself when I saw this question earlier today. And so I was poking around and I read this great article in The Guardian, about how about Norfolk and the Association of American Railroads, which, as you said, represents Norfolk, and how they spent millions in marketing and lobbying over the years. And it was basically saying how most of that money to your point went to media consulting and advertising, like, yeah. And a lot of that money went towards paying for dozens of sponsored articles in The Washington Post and Politico, and publications for policymakers all with the goal of winning over winning them over and federal regulators. Anyway super interesting article in The Guardian,. I recommend checking out if you want to learn more about that.

Kimberly Adams 

The Washington advertising market is so similar. We have all of these TV ads with people being like, “tell your members of Congress to vote no on” fill in the blank, obscure bill. Or to stay out of weird issue because they know that in the DC TV market are: members of Congress, and their staffs, and regulators and all those things. So they run a lot of ads here specifically targeted at changing those people’s minds. And you know, that’s lobbying. All right unto the next question.

Reema Khrais 

Let’s do it.

Becca 

Hello it’s Becca. I’m so glad that Kimberly touched on the issues that she’s personally had with menstruation and having to still go to work. I really would love to know if there’s any data out there that has studied menstruation, lack of access to help, and its effect on productivity. Thanks.

Kimberly Adams 

Ah the misery, the pain.

Reema Khrais 

I hate it. I hate it.

Kimberly Adams 

I know right?

Reema Khrais 

But I’m glad we’re talking about this. I think it’s an important topic. It doesn’t get a lot of public discussion. So menstrual symptoms, yes, they can affect productivity in a number of ways. And there is some research into this. So one study in the British Medical Journal that surveyed Dutch women between the ages of 15 and 45, it found that about 14% of them had stayed home from work or school because of period pain. Another recent study that surveyed users of a period tracking app called “Flow”, it found that a majority of respondents said menstrual symptoms have a moderate to severe impact on their workplace productivity. And that same study found that nearly all of the survey participants didn’t receive any kind of workplace benefits about this, but you know, 75% reported wanting them. And there’s also you know, some research into the inequity when it comes to access to menstrual products. There’s actually term for it’s known as “period poverty.” So one study in a journal called “Obstetrics and Gynecology” from 2021, it found that one in five low income women in the US said they couldn’t afford period products on a monthly basis. And this can prevent people who have periods from being able to go to school or work which, you know, obviously affects productivity. One survey done by a period product companies showed that almost one in five American girls have either missed school or gone home early, because they didn’t have access to period products. Which, honestly, I’ve been there. And you know, it’s important to note that period products like pads, and tampons are not cheap. And things like food stamps, SNAP benefits, you can’t use that to pay for them. And aside from the research, I mean, just anecdotally, I’m sure you can relate to this, Kimberly, I’ve had so many conversations with colleagues and friends over the years about how annoying it can be to be on your period while you’re working. You know, the pain can show up in different ways and different levels of severity for people. But and for me, I think they’re often like one or two days out of the month where the pain is just it’s really distracting. And you can find me with a heating pad on my stomach, some Advil on my desk, and just, you know, trying to get through the workday.

Kimberly Adams 

I absolutely have a heating pad next to my desk and had one at work in the office, because it hurts, you know? And you have to keep pushing through and you know, and then you also want to maintain your positive attitude, you don’t want to show any symptoms of PMS, because God forbid somebody in the office, you know, especially men, God bless them, you know, feel like they can, you know, lean into the stereotype about women and PMS and how we behave in the workplace. Which makes it even harder when you’re already feeling miserable, knowing that you have to sort of watch out for that kind of stuff as well. But, you know, half the population works through it, and it’s no fun.

Reema Khrais 

Hate it.

Kimberly Adams 

But thank you for the question. It’s good to have this conversation.

Reema Khrais 

Totally. Alright, let’s move on to the next question.

Monty 

Hi, this is Monty from Madison. But I was wondering, as far as renewable renewables put in people’s backyards, what sort of incentive are they providing people? Possibly if the government and the state provided, say free power to people from these renewable, they’d be more prone to having in their backyard?

Kimberly Adams 

That’s a good point. So Monty is talking about the conversation we had in our deep dive about needing all of this new renewable energy infrastructure, but a lot of nimbyism, not in my backyard-ism, making people not want, you know, solar fields or windmills or whatever else you know, in their communities. And at the federal and state level, there are a ton of new tax credits, grants and loans to help reduce renewable energy costs for businesses, nonprofits, state and local organizations. But there are also a lot of incentives to get American property owners on board with, you know, bringing some of this smaller scale renewable energy into their home. So there are tax credits and rebates for installing solar panels on your property. Installing these photovoltaic systems are quite expensive, but they can help you save money in the long term and some benefits can help out property owners with the initial costs. One example is the “federal solar investment tax credit.” It provides a 30% tax credit for solar systems that are installed during the tax years from 2022 to 2032, so a 10 year window. On the wind energy side of things. There are also similar incentives, you can claim a tax credit for putting up a small residential, wind electric system on your property. Now for the bigger ask, like putting up a 300 foot wind turbine on your property. Those incentives work a little bit differently. Property owners in rural areas have plenty of open space, can make a deal with a wind energy company that’s building turbines in their area. And the property owner can lease their land in exchange for a percentage of the value of the generated electricity. And you know, at a time when many farmers in the US are struggling financially, these leases can be really beneficial. Plus, there are benefits for the communities who approve large scale renewable projects. Like wind energy companies pay taxes in their project areas, which boosts local funds. And local electricity costs do often go down. One wind energy company in Texas actually does offer free power during nighttime hours to the areas it services. But, you know, we were talking the other day, sort of about the people who maybe don’t want the visual impact, like the windmills in their view or, you know, even a nuclear power plant in their community, which is a whole other set of concerns. And I think Monty is right, in that, you know, there probably will need to be some kind of incentive structure to get people, you know, over the hump a bit.

Reema Khrais 

Yeah that makes sense.

Kimberly Adams 

What do you think it would take for you to deal with a windmill farm in your view?

Reema Khrais 

Hmm. Money.

Kimberly Adams 

Money fixes everything. Money solves all the probelsm. All right. Last question of the day. Let’s go.

Adriana 

Hi, my name is Adriana. I’m calling from San Antonio. If you could go back in time, what financial advice would you give your 16 year old or 18 year old self? Just curious. Thanks for making me smart and sharing your insights.

Kimberly Adams 

Well, you go first you you do…

Reema Khrais 

We could have a whole podcast episode about this. What were you saying?

Kimberly Adams 

You probably have in some version.

Reema Khrais 

I know right? Yeah. So like you mentioned, I host the Marketplace podcast, This is uncomfortable. Yeah, we talk a lot about a relationship with money. So my biggest piece of advice, not earth shattering, but save your money. Right? I think it’s so important. I’m not again, that’s not saying anything we don’t know. But to save for retirement. I think when I was in my early 20s, I would hear that, you know, advice, but you’re in your early 20s, you’re young, you’re not thinking about retirement, let alone what you’re doing the next day. So it wasn’t important to me, at least at the time. And so my advice is when you get that first job, if your employer offers a retirement plan, take advantage of it. Max out your 401 K contributions, especially if your employer matches your contributions. I didn’t realize until my late 20s that I was basically leaving free money on the table by not maxing out my contributions, or at least, you know, offering more. And so you know, even if you’re not employed or, or even if you are employed, I’d also recommend do your own savings in the form of a Roth IRA, which is basically an individual retirement account that allows you to contribute with after tax dollars. So basically the money compounds free of taxes. And speaking of compounding, I mean that’s what this is right? We can’t underestimate the power of compound interest. By doing this, your money is earning money on your money. Like your money is working for you. And it’s one of the best tools out there to build wealth. You know, and you don’t have to do anything right. Once your money is going into your account of choice, whether it’s a high interest savings account, or an investment account, all you have to do is leave it there. And just to put that in perspective. So if two people put the same amount of money away each year, say it’s like $5,000. And they earn the same return on their investments, and they stopped saving at the same time, when it’s time to retire, like when they’re in their 60s. One, we’ll end up with nearly twice as much money just by starting at age 21, instead of age 31. So that is, you know, potentially hundreds of thousands of dollars of dollars you could save if you start early. So that is my biggest piece of advice. Yeah, and it doesn’t have to be a lot, especially if you’re talking about like, as a teenager, you know? Even if you can only put away like 10 20 dollars a week or even a month, you know, just put it somewhere and leave it. Not only because of the powers of compounding interest that you know, Remma was talking about, but also to kind of teach yourself that skill early on, and to get used to paying yourself first. Also try really hard not to loan people money if you can avoid it. Like, obviously, you’ll have friends and family in a pinch, but just even, and especially if someone finds out that you’re a good saver, people will start coming to you for money. And obviously, you want to help out your friends and family when you can. But if you can’t take care of yourself first, you’re going to be no good to anybody. I used to be a great saver when I was a kid. My brothers and sisters like milked me dry. Really? So you’re talking talking from your own experience.

Kimberly Adams 

Yeah, yeah. Like I’m talking like when I was like 10, or 12. And I would be so good at saving my money. And they’d be like, “Oh, I just want a little loan or whatever.” My mother finally was like, “don’t loan your brothers and sisters any more money!” So a little bit bitter. It’s okay. It’s okay. But no, it’s fine. It’s fine. But you know, and also, this is a little bit weird. Insurance, especially when you’re young, if you can get life insurance. And again, it can be pretty cheap. You can get term policies that are like, you know, 10, 20 dollars a month. Get them while you’re very young. Because the older you get, the more expensive they get, and the harder they are to get because you end up with more health problems that makes you less eligible. And a lot of even term life policies will have a feature where if you end up with a really bad critical illness, you might be able to draw some of that. Or if you end up with like a whole life insurance policy, you might be able to, you know, get some of that money back at one point or another. And you know, I’m not an expert, and you know, consult your own financial planner, and this, that and the other. But if you can think about insurance, life insurance, you know, for your loved ones, or yourself, you know, because some policies, you can use it for yourself. But also, you know, if there’s a charity that you really care about, but you maybe don’t have the resources to give them the kind of donations that you want, you can get yourself a little $10 a month term life insurance policy, and set them as the beneficiary and leave a huge gift as your legacy. There are a lot of things you can do with that. So, you know, there are options you can do with money.

Reema Khrais 

That’s great advice, Kimberly. I know we should wrap up soon. But I also want to add one more thing

Kimberly Adams 

It’s a podcast we can we can go on.

Reema Khrais 

We can just keep on chatting. When I think back to my younger self, I wish I could tell her to just cut back on some of the unnecessary spending, like you did not need to buy that $200 dress you wore that one time, but swore to yourself that you’d find other reasons to wear it. You know, especially when you’re that young, you might feel pressured to just like buy and consume and keep up with your friends and wear the latest trends which can lead to a lot of impulsive shopping and a cluttered closet. Like yeah, you don’t need to buy that thing your friend bought or that gadget you saw on TikTok that you know, supposedly revolutionize your life. And so I think it’s really important to ask yourself, what is it that you actually value and getting clear on that can really help. Like I personally really value being generous with the people I love and creating a comfortable home. And so when I know those things, it makes it easier when I’m feeling conflicted on on how to spend my money. So…

Kimberly Adams 

Yeah, my dad used to tell me “if you can say no to the little things you can say yes to the big things.”

Reema Khrais 

Oh, that’s nice.

Kimberly Adams 

Yeah. All right. That’s it for us today on this what do you want to know Wednesday? If you do have a question about business, tech, the economy, ways to stop your siblings from milking you out of money, whatever. You know how to get a hold of us. 508-U-B-SMART also known as 508-827-6278 or makemesmart@marketplace.org

Reema Khrais 

Make me smart is produced by Courtney Bergsieker. Ellen Rolfes writes our newsletter. Our intern is Antonio Barreras, and today’s program was engineered by Juan Carlos Torrado

Kimberly Adams 

Ben Tolliday and Daniel Ramirez composed our theme music. Our acting senior producer Marissa Cabrera. Bridget Bodnar is the director of podcasts and Francesca Levy is the Executive Director of Digital.

Reema Khrais 

That’s it. We did it right?

Kimberly Adams 

Yeah, that’s it. You’re all done.